Week 3: Improving your interpretation and performance!

This week, we will now study our written analysis from last week, and apply to performance interpretation. Some ideas to apply, but not limited to:

 

1. Looking at your labeled phrase groups and the overall form of the selected prelude, create a mind map of the architecture of how the piece is structured. What can we do to make each of those phrases/larger sections special in their unique ways?

2. Key areas and harmonic content: how can we utilize this knowledge to decide on what type of color and character to apply in our performance in dynamics, style, and articulation.

3. Please feel free to upload your performance recordings from this week, and share about how this practice shaped your interpretation!

 

Please reach out to Dr. Eloise Kim below with any of your questions!

 

https://youtu.be/ZCpj6r3Nm80

36 replies

null
    • Eloise_Kim
    • 2 wk ago
    • Reported - view

    Welcome back everyone! I am excited to hear about how the previous week's challenge impact your overall learning experience and application to performance this week. Please feel free to share any notes, recordings, or ask questions if you have any :)

    • Mary_Manuel
    • 2 wk ago
    • Reported - view

    Hello Dr. Kim, Thank you for your insights on the value of analysis in interpreting music.  I have found my analysis of Chopin Nocturne Op. 37 no. 2 to be very helpful in shaping my interpretation. This composition is so interesting and loaded with possibilities. I'm sure I will discover more ways to interpret it as I study it in the future. Thanks again!

      • Eloise_Kim
      • 2 wk ago
      • Reported - view

      Hi Mary! Thank you so much for joining this challenge! Terrific work on your analysis. You are correct that this is in an "A B A B A" with a short additional coda (or in this case, we could call it an 'extension') at the end of the work. I also saw and liked how you added details in notating harmonic analysis in specific measures. This helps us not only for interpretation but also for general memorization to the sound world of how the harmonies are navigating in each new section. Bravo to you!

      I am so happy to hear this analysis practice helped shape your interpretation. If you are joining the Chopin performance next week--I so look forward to hearing your playing! Thank you again, and feel free to let me know if you have any questions :)

    • Philosophy teacher and piano lover
    • Juan_Carlos
    • 2 wk ago
    • Reported - view

    Hi  !

    I'd like to share both assignments (weeks 2 and 3) in this message, because I couldn't find the time last week to complete the first one. I've attached my attempt at the harmony and form analysis, and now I'd like to share a few thoughts on the performance aspect. The piece I chose is Étude Op. 10 Nº5, the "Black Keys" Étude.

    Doing this analysis has been very helpful in understanding the symmetry of the piece, how it is constructed, the harmonic plan, etc. To be honest, this is not something I usually do with the pieces I try to play.

    As a result, the different phrases and periods in which the piece is divided are now much clearer. That's very helpful for phrasing, knowing where to breathe, where to place emphasis, where to make small pauses, and so on.

    The left hand is absolutely essential, as it provides the rhythmic and harmonic foundation, and even more, it carries the main "small melodies" of the piece. I think it was Nathan Perelman who recommended memorizing and practicing the left hand separately as an excellent preparatory exercise (something that my Tonebase couch Stefan Chaplikov has recommended me too).

    Another important point is attention to dynamics. Thanks to the harmonic and form analysis, we can see how detailed and varied they actually are, much more so than one might notice with a more superficial look.

    With all these points (and more) in mind, I'll try to record a video performance next week. You know, it's quite a challenge! 😅.

    Thank you for this extraordinary opportunity and how you've organized it.

      • Eloise_Kim
      • 2 wk ago
      • Reported - view

      Hi Juan! Thank you so much for joining this challenge, and I appreciate your kind words. It is a joy for me to hear that completing this analysis enabled you to discover ways of phrasing, understanding the structure/symmetry of the piece, and give you new ways of navigating the performance interpretation. That was exactly the intent of this two-week intensive for those of you joining, so I am very delighted to hear this!

      I reviewed your attached analysis, and very impressively done! The structure is indeed in Ternary form. Excellent work on your Roman numeral analysis too. Just a quick feedback: you are correct that chords in example m. 15 is a V7 of D-flat Major (it resolves to D-flat Major at measure 16), so we would notate the Roman numeral as a secondary dominant: V7/V in this case of G-flat Major, rather than a II7 to be more exact.

      Like you had mentioned, notating the phrase groups lead to interpretative discoveries, but also it helps us create a detailed practice plan for us physically. For example: I am going to tackle the first eight measure phrase in detail. Then once that detail practice is completed, I will tackle the next 8 measure phrase after. After each of those phrases feel individually comfortable, then I will tackle the entire "A" section: m. 1-16. And next, you could apply the same tactic for B section. You might already be doing this anyway, but just wanted to give a suggestion :)

      I agree with you completely that practicing the LH alone is essential in this piece. Sometimes I like to suggest for students to practice the RH with 'scooping' technique for this etude (and a lot of Chopin etudes for that matter) in slow motion. This is a practice method Horowitz apparently used, and can be applied to this particular etude. A similar example about this scooping technique can be found in the video attached demonstrated by Norman Krieger. This was on our Tonebase YouTube channel. The Horowitz example starts at 2:16. But really, the entire video is great for reference!

      Thank you so much again for joining, and I am very excited to see your performance video at the Chopin Challenge next week!

      • Philosophy teacher and piano lover
      • Juan_Carlos
      • 2 wk ago
      • Reported - view

       Thank you so much, Eloise, for your feedback. Of course, I'll follow your suggestions, and I found Norman Krieger's video very inspiring and helpful. I'm going to try practicing that scooping motion with the right hand. 

      • Eloise_Kim
      • 2 wk ago
      • Reported - view

      you're very welcome, Juan! Happy to hear you enjoyed the Norman Krieger video. I too am very inspired by it! :)

    • Roy_JamesPike
    • 13 days ago
    • Reported - view

    Thank you Dr Kim, I am working on the C~ minor Nocturne. I shall take sections of it and approach them applying harmonic analysis/progression to them.

    I have focused my practice on the trills and where the grace notes fit harmonically with the notes in the bass, similarly with the ornamental scale runs from Bar (Measure) 57 onwards that have contain a range of numbers of notes: 18; 35; 11; and 13.

    The run in Bar 58 appears to me to be modal. I think it would be Mixolydian if we were taking the key as its relative, E major.  I am not sure how the modal relationships work when we're in a minor key.    

      • Roy_JamesPike
      • 13 days ago
      • Reported - view

       That should be C# not C~...

      • Eloise_Kim
      • 12 days ago
      • Reported - view

      Hi Roy! Excellent choice of work! I am assuming this is the c# minor Nocturne, Op. Posthumous? This nocturne is one of my favorite works to teach and play :)

      To answer your question: yes measure 58 can be interpreted as modal. I understand why you came with mixolydian, but personally, I would interpret this more as a G# Phyrigian scale, given that it is using the tonality of E Major and ending at the pitch G#. However, I think in this case it is more useful that you were able to identify that the scale is essentially an E Major, which is going to help with the choice of fingering and how you can divide the poly rhythm. Here in m. 58-62, the RH needs to sound very smooth and like an after-thought as a goal. 

      So happy you are studying this piece and applying harmonic analysis! I hope this activity comes in helpful for your performance interpretation in the future too!

      • Roy_JamesPike
      • 6 days ago
      • Reported - view

       Hello Dr Kim, yes, it is the Op. Posthumous and yes, to the G# Phyrigian. I have a chart for modes and I mis-read the chart! Thanks for your feedback!

    • Amateur piano enthusiast
    • Marc_M
    • 12 days ago
    • Reported - view

    Thank you, , for your feedback on the other thread! I've been practicing Chopin's etude op. 10 no. 4 slowly with metronome each day, and it's been helpful. I found that spots I was messing up at a fast speed I was also messing up at 1/3rd speed...it's a good diagnostic tool. I also identified an issue at the end--I was skipping a 16th beat and ended up unable to keep to the metronome--and so I'm still working on fixing that issue.

    In this video there are other technical problem spots that still need ironing out, even at this not-as-fast-as-marked speed. On that note, 88 bpm is quite daunting...should I aim for it or, as an amateur, just content myself with a ~150 bpm target? it's still pretty exciting at 150ish I think.

    My forearms were getting tired after 4 takes or so. I'm trying to keep wrists supple but I think I may be muscling my way through certain sections too much.

    I also need to think harder about the harmonic analysis I did and how to incorporate it into the interpretation. I think I'm tending to focus more on the technical problems at the expense of dynamics and the "big picture", so that's something I need to work on also. 😅

    The kids also enjoyed adding their flair to the video, haha. I know this is a "last hour" submission, but any feedback you could give would be greatly appreciated! Thank you for your guidance!

      • Eloise_Kim
      • 12 days ago
      • Reported - view

      Hi Marc! Thank you so much for sharing your video! This is a very well done performance on this challenging piece! I am proud of you playing through the entire work through. And adorable to see your kids in the video. They add positive cheers to the video 🎉

      Your touch in the RH is excellent articulate. I know it is much trickier to do in the LH, but applying that articulate touch in the LH more consistently will help take this performance at a new level. Practicing these sixteenths slowly and with a 'scooping of the keys' method will help build those strong fingers and the correct articulation that can come in helpful when adding more velocity too. Marina Lomasov has a terrific lesson on the Tonebase website on practice advises on this etude. I am not able to link the video here, but attached the workbook for you. Since you are a Tonebase member, I am sure you can access the video on the site.

      Your energy and interpretation with the dynamics is terrific! I would advise to continue to practice in smaller sections to larger sections, to help build that stamina overtime. It is also helpful to practice in metronome increments: from slow to faster, in these same sections. And also eventually the full work. I am a believer in that there is no 'right' tempo as long as it delivers accurately, convincingly, and stays consistent. So with that said, the tempo choice is up to you! 

      Just a tiny small feedback from a physical observation: this happens to all of us when we play an intense piece, but careful to not have your shoulders rise/tense up. The more we open our posture and keep the shoulders relaxed, along with an open/relaxed arm motion, it actually makes all the challenging patterns even more physically easier to play. Our bodies do wonders in our piano playing!

      Bravo to your work! So happy to have had you in this intensive! And all the best to your continuous music studying 🙂

      • Amateur piano enthusiast
      • Marc_M
      • 12 days ago
      • Reported - view

       Thank you, Eloise. I will print out these comments of yours and keep them by the piano as a reminder of what I need to be working on! 
      Question—I’m not sure what the “scooping” method is. Would you be able to explain, or link to a video to point me in the right direction?

      Thank you again for your feedback and for leading this intensive! It is a great help.

      • Eloise_Kim
      • 12 days ago
      • Reported - view

      Hi Mark! Thank you! Norman Krieger talks about Horowitz's scooping technique here at this video link: https://youtube.com/shorts/w1xwFlgX6QA?si=AqPX3EqG5FSG7-o4

       

      However the example used in this video is more focused on the production of the larger sound and clarity through this "scooping" technique. To apply it for slow practice in the Chopin Etude, you can see this short video attached. I apologize that I currently do not have access to a proper piano at the moment (it is a keyboard which is causing that clicky noise haha), but hopefully it gives you an idea of the technique to apply. The idea is to release after each note and "scoop" the keys (like an icecream scoop)--if that analogy makes sense. 😄 

      Thank you again for joining this intensive! 

      • Amateur piano enthusiast
      • Marc_M
      • 12 days ago
      • Reported - view

       Thank you! I see what you mean now. You're right, I do this with my right hand decently but my left, not so much. Will work on it. Thanks again for all your help, and see you at your next TWI!

      • Eloise_Kim
      • 11 days ago
      • Reported - view

      Thank you for joining Marc! It's been a pleasure leading this TWI and meeting all of you :) Happy practicing and all the best to your music learning journey👋

    • Personal trainer
    • Judy_Kuan.1
    • 12 days ago
    • Reported - view

    Hi  , I've been working on musical intention this week, and exploring different ways to build energy/drama without relying on speed. Here's a playthru of Op. 53 from this evening (after attending a Body Mapping workshop this weekend - where I played the intro to this polonaise for feedback - and a piano lesson this afternoon). Lots of takeaways that I'm still digesting, but I was inspired by this week's challenge to record a progress video (the first video I've recorded in months!). Already hearing a lot of things that weren't super apparent while I was in the midst of playing it...like how some of my articulations and phrase endings aren't in line with what I'm hearing harmonically.

      • Eloise_Kim
      • 12 days ago
      • Reported - view

      Hi Judy! Thank you so much for sharing your video! This is a really terrific performance. You take us through a wonderful journey through your performance. And I can tell that this piece is very solidly learned--bravo to you for your hard work!

      I like how you are staying physically relaxed and open with your body posture throughout the performance . You also play with the corrected elevated wrist when you get into the LH octaves which gives you great control in that middle section. Impressive! And really beautiful tone is portrayed in all the lyrical sections. I really enjoyed watching and listening to your performance!

      Just couple tiny feedback as you continue to explore this work: Whenever we have the climax sections that require a larger sound: such as the main theme. I think we can explore achieving a fuller sound my incorporating the weight from our core and applying more breath control--so that the sound is full yet contains the same warm quality. And in the lyrical sections of the work, playing with a more flatter finger technique and the cushion part of our fingers, help with this.

      I like to share this video link attached: John Browning (former student of Rosina Lhevinne) talks about this flat finger technique in the opening of this video. The whole video is quite fascinating to watch and I think applicable to many of our piano repertoire :)

      Thank you so much again, Judy! It was so great to have you join this intensive, and I hope all the best to your musical learning!

      • Personal trainer
      • Judy_Kuan.1
      • 9 days ago
      • Reported - view

       Thank you for the helpful feedback! I've been trying the flat finger suggestion for some of the trills that were sounding messy/uneven, and it really helps at the speed I'm going (for slower tempo, I was using the scoop method you mentioned to Marc, but my fingers collapse at higher tempi). In the main polonaise theme, I'm still trying to work on creating the robust warm sound while making sure the RH can be heard - I can see from my video that I'm forcing the sound to get enough volume while playing in a stretched position. Feeling like my hands are warmed up enough seems to help - what the video you shared mentioned about Double Sixths being a great warmup/stretch is really interesting, and I'm going to try incorporating that next! (I currently play double thirds as a warmup - which helps with the Polonaise introduction - but have been avoiding double sixths 😅)

    • Angela_Fogg
    • 12 days ago
    • Reported - view

    Hello all,

    Unfortunately, it seems I have been working on Op. 27 no. 2, not Op. 37 no.2. However, too late to go back now and all I can do is apologise. I have analysed all the chords and as Dr Kim says there are a considerable number of seventh chords and secondary dominants so for example if I look at the end of bar 12 I have a F7th  secondary dominant chord which leads to the B-flat minor chord in the next bar, this B-flat chord then becomes a secondary dominant which leads to the E flat minor chord at the beginning of bar 14. A series of dominant/tonic progressions. Each one fulfilling expectations within itself but a slightly unexpected feeling as well as it is not the dominant/tonic of the home key. Another feature would be the use of chromatic  bass lines so for example in bar 22 we start with a C which goes to C flat, repeated Cb flat which goes to B natural to A natural which becomes B double flat and then to A flat your dominant cord which finally takes you to back to Db the tonic chord. A resolution that is even sweeter because of the changing chords and this chromatic bass line that leads up to it. There was also use of pedal notes, for example the last page uses the Db tonic note as a pedal note virtually throughout. Bars 62 to 65 use the D-flat pedal note with a cascade of diminished seventh chords above up to bar 65 where we get Ab 7th dominant chord over the D flat pedal note finally giving us the tonic chord of Db flat in bar 66. Only need to start moving again with another series the same, different melody line, and finally resolving at bar 70. Keeping the dominant/tonic alternating chords over the Db bass note the piece finally comes to rest at bar 76.

    It is tempting to almost describe it as kind of through composed piece but with a recurring melody starting at bars 2, 26, 46. Each time the melody is in Db but is further developed and decorated until the last page where the music winds down, chromatic harmonies over the Db pedal, simple melodic patterns finally finishing in a scale in 6ths leading simply to the Db chord. Three variations and a coda??

    I’m admiringly the recordings so far. I hope to record mine after the weekend- if it’s too late it’s too late- more apologies!

      • Eloise_Kim
      • 11 days ago
      • Reported - view

      Hi Angela! Thank you so much for your analysis! No need to apologize at all :) I am assuming you mean the Op. 27 no. 2 D-flat Major Chopin Nocturne. You are correct that this piece is filled with several seventh chords and secondary dominants. And I like your sensitive observation of the chromatic bass line which is a compositional technique Chopin uses very often in this pieces. It certainly leads to a sweeter resolution as you have noted, and gives a nice preparation for us as listeners (and as the performer)--creating that warm and 'safe' quality.

      You have done a marvelous analysis on this nocturne, so big applause to you. I could see why you interpreted this as three variations and a coda. But the main analysis traditionally for this nocturne has been interpreted as Ternary form + Coda. The first "A" section being measures 1-9. Then the "B" section starting at measure 10 (moving into the key of b-flat minor) to 24. And the final "A" section returns at measure 26. And yes you are correct this nocturne ends with an extended Coda in which they incorporate both the "A" and "B" themes.

      I am happy to hear you have been listening to several recordings! If you are joining the Chopin party, I look forward to hearing your recording performance!

      Thank you again for joining this challenge, and all the best to your continuous music-learning :)

      • Angela_Fogg
      • 10 days ago
      • Reported - view

      Thank you so much!

    • TT2022
    • 10 days ago
    • Reported - view

    Hi Eloise! Thank you so much for this challenge and your instructional videos. Like Juan Carlos and others, I'm combining my submission for Weeks 2 and 3 here. 

    Score analysis pics are attached, the first two pages. The piece is essentially in A-B-A format. The exposition and recap essentially alternate a lot between V and I chords, B major and E major. Chopin constructs pretty long phrases — usually 8 or 12 bars, with 4 bar sub-phrases within that. 

    The development is interesting and was complex to analyze harmonically. He starts with a new theme, in B major which is repeated in the darker C# minor. Things slowly build and more chromatic and then really loud, where it's a whole bunch of ascending chromatic double fourths and diminished chords that I don't even know how to describe (!)

    The climax of the piece is probably the big loud B major chord in bar 46 and it's extended via a tense 8-bar con bravura passage of diminished double sixths (bars 46-54) that lead to a more placid 8-bar transition back to the home theme finally at bar 62. This marks the beginning of the recap and home stretch. 

    Attached is a video. One thing I'm struggling with is how to execute the rubato hairpins faithfully without sounding stilted or weird. The hairpins appear everywhere and right away even in the opening bars!  

      • Eloise_Kim
      • 10 days ago
      • Reported - view

      Hi Tammy! This is a really beautiful performance, and fantastic work done on your analysis! I can hear that you are really listening to your phrase directions and harmonic content of the work. Bravo. I agree with your arrival of the climax, and thought you controlled the timings super well in your performance too. Such a pleasure to hear you play!

      Thank you so much for joining this intensive. And also for sharing your insights on this piece :) All the best to your continuous music learning journey!

Content aside

  • 4 Likes
  • 3 days agoLast active
  • 36Replies
  • 218Views
  • 13 Following